What lead you to write a book on Sonic Youth — and why now?
I’ve been writing about the band on and off since the ‘80s, for a variety of publications from Entertainment Weekly to the New York Times. In 2005, with their 25th (!) anniversary on the horizon, I thought the time was right for what I hoped would be a comprehensive, definitive biography of the band, its music and career, and its influence on the culture. Their basic story — from the suburbs of America to the grimy streets of the Lower East Side to, among other things, a guest spot on The Simpsons — felt like an epic saga that hadn’t yet been told, at least up to this time. Plus, it would be a great excuse to spend more time with records I’ve been listening to and loving for over two decades.
I’ve heard of Sonic Youth but never actually heard them. What makes them worth a book?
It’s pretty simple: Their impact, even on people who’ve never seen them in concert or heard one of their few radio-friendly songs, like Kool Thing. For over twenty years, Sonic Youth have been considered godfathers of alternative or indie rock. But their influence extends far beyond that world. In their journey, they’ve nurtured a slew of groundbreaking musicians, artists, film directors, and actors. They not only brought their art-centered sensibility and their friends into the mainstream but effectively altered the mainstream along the way. In general, the Sonic Youth sensibility — serious about art yet in love with the trashy fun and arch, ironic aspect of other parts of pop culture — is all around us.
Who exactly have they nurtured or encouraged throughout their career?
Nirvana, of course: Sonic Youth championed them when they were still a Sub Pop indie band, and Nirvana then followed Sonic Youth to Geffen Records, changing rock history along the way. Sofia Coppola acted in one of their videos, Mildred Pierce, in 1990; a few years later, Sonic Youth’s Thurston Moore handed her a copy of a novel called The Virgin Suicides, which inspired Coppola to become a director. Spike Jonze was a skateboard and BMX video maker and photographer when he received a call from Kim Gordon about co-directing a Sonic Youth video in 1992; thanks to that exposure, Jonze went on to become a major filmmaker. (Also appealing in that Jonze-Sonic Youth video was skater and soon-to-be-actor Jason Lee, incidentally.) Up-and-coming artists whose work has appeared on Sonic Youth album covers — Raymond Pettibon, Richard Prince, Mike Kelley, and others — have gone on to major careers complete with museum retrospectives. The list goes on and on. Did you know that Chloe Sevigny did her first acting in a Sonic Youth video, in 1992 — and was even one of Gordon and Moore’s babysitters when they had a child? I didn’t know that until I began researching and reporting this book.
What makes those kind of people gravitate toward Sonic Youth?
Sonic Youth have always been the music world’s equivalent to the coolest kids in the cafeteria: One becomes “cool” by association with them, I suppose. But at the same time, their collaborations with the people above (as well as director-writer Harmony Korine, photographers-filmmakers Richard Kern and David Markey, and many others) are natural extensions of the band’s interest in the intersection of music, art, photography, and literature.
How receptive were they to the idea of a book? What kind of access and cooperation did you receive?
From the moment I contacted them (through their manager), they were instantly supportive of an outsider like myself writing a biography. More importantly, they never asked for final approval or any such thing over the manuscript. All four of the core members are insanely busy all the time, but they managed to carve out time for me — in person, on the phone, wherever—over the course of two years. I also spoke with peers, fellow musicians, executives who worked with them at indie labels and Geffen, family members, and high school friends. (Kim Gordon’s high school boyfriend, incidentally, was Danny Elfman, who spoke with me about those days for I believe the first time.) The funniest moment came when Moore was driving from Massachusetts to New York for a business meeting and realized he would only have time to talk with me by phone — in the car. He called at the appointed time, but since he doesn’t have a speaker phone in his car, every so often he’d say, “Wait, I see a cop,” and put down the phone for a few minutes.
What surprised you, or what new information did you uncover?
For all their onstage chaos, I was intrigued by the way they run their business: very pragmatic, logical, largely democratic. They want to be “loose” yet very much in control, which has led to some problems over the years with the music business (detailed in the book). Readers will learn more about what went on behind the scenes, with both record companies and within the band itself. Jim O’Rourke, who was a member of the band for the first half of this decade, spoke openly for the first time about his reasons for leaving, and Moore and Lee Ranaldo also discussed the traumatic period in the band’s career, in 1992, when long-simmering tensions in the band finally erupted during the making of the Dirty album.
That said, you won’t find any car crashes or overdoses in the book; they’re not that kind of band. Their story is more human-scale, which is also what appealed to me. It’s sort of the anti-Behind the Music, centered around a couple who have been married and band mates for over twenty years. It’s about people going crazy on stage but holding it together — as a band, as a business, as a marriage — offstage. In that regard, it’s a pretty unusual and remarkable saga, at least to me.
What are your favorite Sonic Youth albums?
Impossible to say — the list changes all the time. The early classics — Sister, Daydream Nation — stand out and are records I always return to, along with Goo and Dirty. But I also developed an appreciation for their later work: A Thousand Leaves now sounds to me like one of their best, and most relaxed, records. I also rediscovered B-sides, singles and non-album tracks I’d forgotten or hadn’t heard in years: I’m now convinced that Halloween is one of their greatest recordings.
Any favorite moments while researching the book?
I just loved the clash of cultures (and worlds) I was constantly witnessing. One day I’m interviewing Moore while he watches his daughter Coco play in a soccer game. The next moment, I’m at a show in New York and seeing various Famous Friends—Vincent Gallo, Chloe Sevigny, former drummer Bob Bert, musician-producer Don Fleming, and so forth—mingling backstage. Or, in the middle of one interview with Moore, watching as his cell phone rings and it’s Karen O from the Yeah Yeah Yeahs, calling from Japan to pick his brain about record producers.
What other themes did you encounter in writing the book?
The story of Sonic Youth also encompasses the rise of a separate, parallel arts universe of music, zines, underground comics and films, painting, and poetry, as well as the emergence (and attempted co-opting) of alternative music in the '90s (Lollapalooza!) and the rise - and decline - of New York City as a cultural mecca (replaced by places like Northampton, Massachusetts, where Moore and Gordon currently live). A lot of threads run through their story, and I tried to touch upon them all.
Your previous books were on Jeff and Tim Buckley and extreme sports. What’s the connection?
For any number of reasons, I seem to be drawn to the same type of story: artists or movements (like extreme sports) that start out underground and grass roots and then are slowly swept up into the mainstream. How do they maintain their integrity and credibility in the process? How do keep their identities while corporations around them try to co-opt them? It’s not easy, especially in the overly commercialized modern world, and I find that struggle compelling.
How do they make their guitars sound like that?
Even though I know the technical answer — strings tuned differently and so forth — I’m still trying to figure that out myself. Then again, some things are best left a mystery, right?